18 STR, NO INT
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no interference |
Re: yo | |||||
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Are you even capable of positive feedback or has it freed itself from your grasp? I'm getting tired of seeing you complain in every thread you post in.
18 STR, NO INT |
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Second Talon |
Re: yo | |||||
Quote: Probably from the question I put forth around November asking if people here wanted me to update the FAQs I'd already done. The answer was yes. Quote: *shrug* If you say so. Quote: Where they belong, I might add. Quote: Why bother with anything? It amuses me to do so. That, and if I'm going to have all this useless knowledge in my head, I'm gonna infect it on someone else so they can suffer with me. Quote: Sure there is. Forgotten Realms, anyone? Quote: Hey, that's your opinion. All I can say is, from all the creation myths I've read, the only one that makes any sort of sense and doesn't directly contradict itself is that one. And even then, I had to work to make it fit. And Thally, I'll get to your questions when I get home from work. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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HerrRabe |
Re: yo | |||||
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What role do the elemental planes have in the creation of the mutiverse?
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Second Talon |
Re: yo | |||||
Quote: Well, there is no Plane where the Blood War is fought. Every Lower Plane has seen battle, though the Abyss and Hell the least. Probably the most contested ground would be the Grey Waste, though not by much. Both Carceri and Ghenna have seen their share. As for the battles.. I'll leave that to the Blood War FAQ for the discussion on Fiendish Strategy, though to answer the last bit.. Yes, it's a very chaotic battlefield, and more than one Fiend has been surrounded, fought for hours to free himself from his enemies to emerge victorious, only to look around and see that the battle itself has moved on, and only corpses surround him. Quote: Not very well, which is a point of pride in the Demons. As much talk as the Devils do about Order and as much showing as they do before combat with their intricate battle formations, once the fighting has started, they're as disorganized as the Demons... at least to their point of view. The Devils claim that every move is carefully planned, but war is chaos. As much as they hate the chaos of war, they have to fight. Quote: Only if you want to go to the Dutch version of a Mental Hospital. What is that anyway, Mega's house? Quote: Probably that the Celestials are doing the exact same thing, only in a less violent manner. That, and that without the Blood War, the entire thing would have long since been overrun by evil. Hands down, they've got the numbers. Quote: That is difficult to say. The Outer Planes were born of belief, and as a result they can be shaped by belief. The Inner Planes have nothing to do with belief. They simply are. To put it another way, The Outer Planes are opinions. The Inner Planes are facts. It's hard to say just when they were created. Perhaps even before the Primal Forces began their existance. Certainly long before they begain joining with each other and spawning champions. Still, all the Inner Planes do is provide a basis for the raw materials that make up existance. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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Khaine |
lords | |||||
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1.where did the warious lords of the lower planes come from, as it seems like most of the deamonprinces and achdevils are unike, and does not belong to any of the known types of deamon/devils? 2. this may be a bit of topic, but where did sigil come from? |
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Black Plauge |
Re: lords | |||||
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Did the creation of the prime material (or the first prime of many) have anything to do with the actions of the fiends? If so, Who, What, Where, When, Why, and How?
Black holes are where God divided by zero. |
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Second Talon |
Re: lords | |||||
Quote: Some say that the Lords are the Yugoloths that drove the larva to their respective plane. Either they were touched again by Law/Chaos and were thrown out of the 'loth society, and as a result had to start life again elsewhere (And where is better than the leaders of a race?) or that they were ordered to stay and keep an eye on the young fiends, controlling their evolution. The only reason to give the theory that the Lords are former Yugoloths any credit whatsoever is the violent responses all three of the fiendish races have when asked about this idea. Still, the more likely cause is... Ahriman/Asmodeus shaped some of the first Pit Fiends into the Lords, and as for the Demons... there's no such thing as a "typical" demon. Every one of them is unique. Quote: Who knows. Which came first, Sigil or the Lady. No one knows, and she's not telling. Quote: Did the fiends have any hand in the creation of the Prime? No, not at all. That's pretty much still in the hands of the Gods there (Which is a whole other idea). Did the creation of the Prime influence the Fiends? Oh yes.. First, the new influx of evil souls made the fiends realize there was even more out there than the Outer Planes. Each side realized that whoever won the Blood War would be able to take the whole Universe. Second, and more important to the war itself, the appearance of these new, evil souls, gave both armies reinforcements. So, once both sides realized the Prime existed, the fighting got worse. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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Second Talon |
Re: lords | |||||
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Anyone have any more questions, or is this ready for the Archives?
And yes, I realize that there's not much to ask at this point.. I haven't gotten to the good stuff yet. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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pbryant |
yo | |||||
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Tried to write this last night, but the board hiccupped and I lost my work.
I've been thinking about the idea that the Prime is a major target for Demons and Devils. Specifically, that they can win the Blood War by corrupting humans and whatnot. I have a hard time believing this, for two reasons: 1)The Planes are infinite, therefore, they appear to have infinite resources, limited only by extraction speed - and Fiends could breed a huge and ever-growing number of laborers on that space. The Material is not so unlimited. In fact, in many worlds, there may only be one Prime world for that universe, or even less. Faerun appears to now have its own cosmology and planar organization, regardless of Kara-Tur, much less Greyhawk. There has been some traffic in the past, perhaops, but no mass migration, not anymore. 2) The Prime may indeed be a major target, but not for the reason even the Fiends think. Owning the Prime would make the possessor master of very large magical reserve. Moreover, tilting the balance to them could earn the new lords of the Prime service from many other beings and creatures, which might tip the balance. It would open up new invasion routes, and Prime Wizards and Sorcerers can do things Fiends can't - summon up other fiends. Ergo, if one controlled enough Prime arcane spellcasters, one could decapitate the enemy forces. Doing this to Devils would be devastating. Doing this to Demons would be even worse - Devils would soon produce new leaders, if not so good as the old. The Demons would immediately fall into a mass civil war, making their current cycle of death and pain look like Easy Street. But it depends a bit on how you run the afterlife in different games. |
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Psionic Dwarf |
Re: yo | |||||
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i'm not sure if this was asked yet, but:
what are the nine planes of hell like to visit? how are non-natives treated? i suppose there is government, or at least something like it because they are lawful, but what form would it take? what do devils do when they are not trying to promote themselves, law or evil? if a devil dies on another plane, what heppens to it's body? is it true that devils can only be turely killed on thier native plane? *thanks . |
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pbryant |
yo | |||||
Quote: From what I understand, Devils will *usually* not hurt you so long as you stick within very strictly delineated boundaries. If you act extremely polite and take care of business, you'll probably come out alive. Now, if yu're found roaming the wastes at random, there's no one to protect you and no open law that defends you - anyone you see may not be outright hostile, but you are still in a dangerous position. Now, in more "civilized lands" in Baator, you'll be poorly trated, but not physically hurt. Officials will demand bribes and make you jump through hoops, but you'll make it out. But that's just my reading. And there are places even in Baator's cities where no human may safely tread. I strongly suggest you obtain the services of a guide. A simple contract and generous payment should get you the honest, if sarcastic services of a Baatezu guide. Quote: Government appears to be done largely by autocracy. At the top is Asmodeus and below him his Devilish vassals and the Dark 8. Below that, there's gonna be an intricate and painfully complex bureaucracy. navigating it swiftly and successfully requires one of several things: money, power, or influence. Given enough time you can probably get through it. I expect that part of the bureaucratic fun is eventually, after making you whimper and plead and act all submissive, is finally and oh-so-easily giving you what you wanted. They'll move fast if you can punish them or have something to offer. Quote: Well, on some level, they're always looking for advancement. But probably they eat, drink, play games, have sex... the usual things sentient creatures do. They have hobbies. Maybe they even fall in love and hang out with friends. Even evil beings need companionship. |
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no interference |
Re: yo | |||||
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...
18 STR, NO INT |
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pbryant |
heh | |||||
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What? Surprised I didn't unleash my "Swarm of Relentless Hatred attack?
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no interference |
Re: heh | |||||
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No, I'm surprised that first, you came in here and criticized the thread, then made a post asking questions, THEN felt like you needed to answer questions yourself. Have you ever seen a doctor for multiple personality disorder?
18 STR, NO INT |
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Psionic Dwarf |
Re: heh | |||||
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hey pbryant, thanks for answering my questions.
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Aranan |
Re: heh | |||||
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Both of you, hush. This is ST's FAQ; you ask the questions, he answers.
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Second Talon |
Re: heh | |||||
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Since this is a universal FAQ, I'll answer these questions as if they inquired about the other Fiends as well.
Quote: Hell - So long as you stick to the first two layers, and so long as you aren't a radiant beacon of Good (such as a Paladin), and so long as you stick to the towns or, in the case of the second layer, stick to the nicer parts of town, you'll be fine... most likely. Abyss - ... Depends on what mood they're in. Gehenna (Yugoloths) - So long as you're not poking around in places you shouldn't be, you'll be mostly ignored, but also occasionally offered a wide variety of services and goods. Carceri (Ghereleths) - So long as you don't try to leave, they'll leave you alone. As a rule, the Ghereleths don't mind visitors, but they keep the petitioners there. The problem is, they have a hard time telling visitor from native. Quote: Devils - Yes. It basically goes Least-Lesser-Greater-Pit Fiends-Minor Dukes and such-Dark Eight-Lords of the Nine in descending order. As near as I know, there are no elected officials (But plenty of Lawyers... bad joke, sorry) or anything like that. It's a very multi-tiered Feudalism, but with each lower not only answering to the one above them, but to the ones above their superiors... Think Corporate Life. Demons - *Laugh* Yugoloths - The race as a whole follows the whims of the General of Gehenna, but also tries to further their own, private goals as well. Or perhaps it's the other way around. Hard to say. Ghereleths - Well.. they just barely qualify as having a society. Just another case of Lesser-Middle-Greater. Quote: I'm afraid I don't quite know what you're asking here. If you're asking if the Devils (Or Demons or whatever) favor a part of their alignment more than the other, the answer is No. They are Law, they are Evil. They are not 50/50 of each, they are 100% all the way. Anyway, care to clarify your question? Quote: Depends. If it was summoned, the body goes *Poof*. If it was Gated, or traveled via Planar Gates, then it's dead. For the most part, the normal decomposition processes take hold. (Any that do not follow this rule will be discussed in later FAQs) Now, in the case of Demons and Devils, the universe is now short one of these creatures. Big deal. In the case of the Yugoloths, a brand new Mezzoloth is immediatly formed in Gehenna. (Going off memory here) I'm fairly certain that it does not matter how high the Yugoloth, the new one is always a Mezzoloth. The numbers stay the same, but the experience is lost. Quote: Yes and no. When you're talking about a Summoned Fiend, if it is of sufficent power (A True Tanari'ri or a Greater Baatezu) then it is actually re-born on it's home plane. The Devil comes back as a Nupperibo, while the Demon simply re-forms. The Devil, if found and identified, is put on the fast track of advancement. The Demon need simply to focus his hate and desire to live to be re-formed. Both processes take millenia. In other words, if the party kills a Demon/Devil, summoned or not, for all purposes it's dead to the party (Unless they're immortal, of course) For Devils, if the creature left of it's own free will (And following orders is considered "Free Will" in this context) then the Devil is dead. No reforming. Demons, Yugoloths, and Ghereleths all follow this rule. Again, with the Ghereleths, if killed, a new one of the type slain is formed. With the Yugoloths, it is always a new Mezzoloth. This occurs whether or not the Fiend slain was summoned or gated. Quote: True, most of this depends on the open, general idea of Death. When a creature dies, it goes to the plane of it's alignment. Some merge with the plane itself, others are reborn in the form of petitioners. These petitioners either evolve into greater and greater forms, or are eventually absorbed by the plane itself. Now, corrupting mass quantities of humans does help, but not to the extend it is often made out to be. Demons and Devils do spawn at random, but they do not spawn as quickly as mortal souls arrive. A strongly evil soul makes a stronger Fiend. Combine those two facts, and the Prime suddenly does become a large target. You have not long mortals who can summon and command Fiends to fight Fiends, and shining holy Paladins with Fiend-slaying abilities, but once dead, they become another soldier in the armies of Hell or the Abyssal Forces. The ultimate Fiendish Goal is... and I'll use the Devil point of view.. just reverse the names for the Demons. Trick Holy Light Party X into venturing into the Abyss. Holy Light Party X has two Paladins and a Wizard. Give Wizard summoning spells, ones that summon Demons. Get Holy Light Party X to summon Demons to fight Demons. Eventually, begin Operation:Immortal Soul Corruption. End goal is to promote Orderly and Selfish tendancies among the party members. Kill party, or have party killed, or let nature take it's course. Find Larva of mortals, shape into Lemures. Again, as a quick recap; Demons and Devils are the only Fiendish races who can increase their numbers with mortal souls, Yugoloths want to turn everything into Evil, and the Ghereleths keep their heads low, unless they see a Yugoloth (In which case they try to kill it). So, the Demons, Devils, and Yugoloths are the only fiends with an interest in the Prime, and of those three, the Yugoloths are the least interested, as the Prime isn't shaped by beliefs as are the Outer Planes. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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Psionic Dwarf |
Re: heh | |||||
Quote: what i mean is, do they play hacky sack or anything? ya know, fun stuff... do they farm? make things? build good friendships? . |
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Second Talon |
Re: heh | |||||
Quote: Devils - Not really. Every "friendship" is forged just to be a stepping stone on the way to power. If they did engage in any sort of sport or leisure activity, it would simply be to show how they are superior to their peers. The closest thing they do engage in would be Music and Art, of which they have a decent number of creators.... Of course, no one but a Fiend would find the results at all appealing. Demons - Yes. All of the above, None of the Above. Yugoloths - They do have side projects, but it's hard to say where the side projects begin, and the orders end. Otherwise, see the Devils above. Ghereleths - If beating up on the Farastu (Least Ghereleth) is considered Leisure, then yes. The only thing worth listening to that Johnny Cash has put out was his rendition of Hurt. - Ishn, 12/19/03 2:43 pm |
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pbryant |
yo | |||||
Quote: Y'know, it still sounds like a lot of work for comparitively little gain. And aren't the results as likely to kill each other off in the intercine power struggles? I personally always wondered what this "merging with the plane" was all about, too. I suppose it would be sort of unique to each. In Arcadia you might become a very quiet peice fo the world, in the Abyss perhaps a muderous flamespout or something. |
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