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How can you play such a creature? I mean, as a DM, how can you use it so that it doesn't act against it's nature?

Very, very carefully. I'm writing up a document that I'll send to Jim to publish on the main site about this very subject.

In the meantime.. All fiends, even the Demons, are very smart as well as evil. Chaotic Stupid they are not. No demon, no matter how enraged, will blindly rush into a battle. Even the Demons have enough foresight to make sure they can win. Though, when dealing with Mortals.. they are pretty much sure they will always win.

Why don't the Yugos rule? Shouldn't they be running things instead of acting as mercenaries for either group? I realize that they are playing both sides, keeping the stalemate, but WHY? What do they have to gain?


Who says they aren't? The Yugoloths have a grand plan for Evil. Not Lawful Evil, not Chaotic Evil, just Evil. Though they cannot stop the Blood War, I'm not so sure they would want to. In fact, I have reasons to suspect they are the ones who started the whole mess in the first place.

Keeping Devils and Demons occupied with trying to kill each other leaves the Yugoloths with ample time to corrupt the entire universe to their brand of Evil. When it comes to lies and deception, I put the Yugoloth Race as a whole and Azmodeus on the same level. They're pretty much equals.

And yes, the Yugoloths can deceive circles around Devils. Fiends are just barely harder to deceive than your average mortal... at least for them.

As for what they have to gain.. Well, like I said, with the Demons and Devils occupied, they have all the time they need to spin their webs large enough to drag the entire universe into Evil.

Also, why are the devils (and to some extent the demons) unable to see them for what they really are? Does non-neutral evil mean stupid? Shouldn't they think something is going on?

For starters, if you're talking normal plots and deceptions.. The Yugoloths are just that good. They can lie and cheat circles around Devils and Demons. Now, when you're talking mercenary work.. well, it basically comes down to the fact that each side knows the other has the opportunity to hire the same mercenaries as well, or at least another group of equal power.

To hire them risks the Yugoloths turning stag.

To not hire them assures that the opposing side will be much larger, and far harder to destroy.

It's not that they like hiring Yugoloths. They pretty much have to, because if they don't, the other side will.

Finally, shouldn't the forces of good be equally ponderous and/or worried that Ahriman (forgive the spelling) is missing? The primal evil and destruction force is... somewhere... doing... something... Oh well, let's have a milkshake! Does being good mean being stupid? Can you only be intelligent if you are neutral evil?

The forces of Good have no idea Ahriman exists. But to call him the Primal Evil and Destruction force is a bit incorrect. Ahriman is first and foremost a champion of Law. He just happens to be the evil facet of Order.

Seriously though, how is everyone in the multiverse oblivious to what the Yugoloths and Asmodeus are up to - and what ARE they up to?!?

Funny thing is, the Yugoloths and Asmodeus have the exact same basic plan. Break the universe as it is and re-create in in their/his image. Of course, Azzie and the 'loths have a completely different idea about what the proper form is, and they have different ways of doing it.

First off, you have to understand that the Planes run on belief. If every single creature in Mount Celestial suddenly began thinking and acting in an evil manner.. well, Hell would suddenly grow seven more layers, populated with evil Solars and whatnot.

It's more or less like a seesaw. Right now, it's more or less balance, both with regards to good/evil and law/chaos. But tilt that balance, and the whole thing goes out of whack. That's the idea the Yugoloths are following. A little evil here, a little evil there. The right word at the right time can change the course of the universe.

And that's their plan. To slowly convert every single living creature to a more evil way of thinking. They don't have to make Solars become evil.. just Neutral. That'd be all it would take.

Perhaps kill a god at an apropriate time... even an evil god. Especially if another will rise in his place, but not surrender the domains when the "dead" god is ressurected... The resulting religious war would be certain to spread evil far and wide. (Bane in FR, anyone?)

And Jazarin, while she could tell the celestials what is going on.. she honestly hasn't got a clue as to Ahriman's plans. She suspects many different things, and can prove none of them.

Not to mention the conversation would be a little rediculous.

Jazarin "Asmodeus plans to destroy the universe!"
Solar ".. Duh.. where have you been the past.. oh.. existance? You just now figured that out?"

''Also, why does Ahriman want to destroy the multiverse? Would it not be more ordered to simply destroy the chaotic aspects of the multiverse instead of total annihilation and reconstruction?''

Oblivion tends to be lacking in chaotic elements. No multiverse means everything is nice and non-existent - which is a constant, which is nicely lawful.

Interesting theory, Skylo.. interesting indeed.

But, from what I've read...

When Ahriman and Jazarin created the universe, they could not agree on a center. So, one was never chosen.

In Ahriman's mind, the universe is flawed on a fundamental level. The only true Orderly way to "fix" it is to completely unmake it, and then create it anew. With Hell as the center.

If you want to think about how that would look, right now the Outlands are the de facto center of the multiverse.

Where are the forces of Chaos, Good and Evil?

They're around...

(Bad answer, I know. But, I don't have any books that mention it. Sloppy writing on TSR's part)

Where are the Yugoloth-equivalents for Law, Chaos and Good?

As it was said above, if you think of the Yugoloths as being the purest form of Evil, then Slaadi, Modrons, and Neutral Good Celestials would be the equivalents.

(Now, I'm off to work. Back later to clear things up)

(Thally Edit: Sorry, couldn't resist. Some formatting errors solved. I like this one to look good. )

kahluah pretty much summed it up. So long as an agreement still suits the Yugoloth's plan, the Yugoloth will uphold it. The moment it ceases to serve him, he ignores it.

1. Is there any good sourcebook for the different types of 'loths?

Any of the old 2e Planescape Monster Compendiums, Faces of Evil: The Fiends, or Hellbound: The Blood War. Those last two are my main sources, but the other Planescape stuff fits in here and there.

2. What is their general numbers versus the numbers of demons and devils and power on a case-by-case basis?

Devils are pretty much in an infinite number. Demons are even more so.. There's an infinite number of Devils on the Nine layers of Hell, and an Infinite number of Demons on an infinite number of layers in the Abyss. Both infinite, but one's much larger than the other.. if that makes sense.

Yugoloths have a certain number, as they can only create more via breeding with each other. The higher creatures breeding (Arcanaloths, Nycaloths, Ultraloths) always results in an Arcanaloth, but an Arcanaloth without the life experience of his bretheren. These are usually assigned clerical duties... as in, keeping libraries, balancing the books, etc etc.

All other Yugoloths create Mezzoloths with their offspring. Still, the Yugoloth leaders discourage breeding, as they have a very select program in place that each Yugoloth must follow, and too many weaklings could spoil the whole thing.

3. Would a typical yugoloth do rampaging and pillaging Fall of Myth Drannor style or was that just a poor choice in villan?
Well, I'm not quite familar enough with Myth Drannor to say, but my gut instinct is to say no. Not in a million years. The Yugoloth way would be to quietly give the silly mortals enough knowledge to kill themselves off, then quietly slip into the now ruined town and take whatever it is they wanted. If they were after something, at least.


4. Are they summoned less because mages know the yugoloths are too good at lying or do they just not bother?

Well, unless you know a Yugoloth's name, you get a Guardian Yugoloth.. a pretty much brainless servant that isn't even considered a true member of the race. The Guardian's lot in life is more like a Golem than anything. Created for a purpose, then left to fufill that goal. That's one reason.

Another is that by the time a Mage studies enough to find out a Yugoloth's name, he probably has long since decided that summoning one would be a very bad thing. With a Devil, if you write a contract good enough, you have the slight chance that you can get the better deal. Slight, but it's there. Demons you just bully into submission, then set them on their task.

Yugoloths, however.. Try to bully them, and they'll not comply.. force means little to them. Try to write a contract, and they'll follow it, until they change their minds. And more than likely, they'll have a contract ready to go when you summon one anyway. And only a fool would sign a Fiend's contract.

How are the Yugoloths undermining Good? You said they are making everyone just a bit more evil all the time - how are they accomplishing that?

The race as a whole presents itself in a very mercenary way. Everything they have can be had for a price. Now, if you're out on the planes, you'll probably meet one. Heck, several shops in Sigil are owned and operated by Arcanaloths. Great magical items, good prices, wonderful customer service.

Now, one day, while you're at the shop, the Arcanaloth behind the counter pulls you aside and says "Careful friend, I think your pal over there might be holding out on you. Count your shares a little better next time"

Sure enough, at the end of the next adventure, when you count the shares, you count extra carefully, and it turns out Bob is holding back a nice chunk of the prize. While everyone else was taking 10%, Bob was taking an extra 5% off the top.

Even though you know the Arcanaloth is a creature from the lower planes, you still start to trust him.. just a little. He was kind enough to point out Bob was stealing from everyone else.

So, now you and your group gets hired to raid an old crypt somewhere. While shopping, you happen to mention this to the 'Loth. He says "Oh.. that crypt. I have a map that should show you at least part of the way in. Here, since you're such a good customer, I'll throw it in with your purchases today.. My treat."

As you explore the crypt, you don't trust the map, but you do look at it from time to time. Sure enough, it's very, very accurate.. right down to the traps. You even manage to avoid a few, thanks to the map.

After quite a while, with the Arcanaloth advising you on your adventures, you pretty much trust the guy. All his information turned out to be true, he's never sold you a faulty magical item, and some of his advice has saved your life a few times.

On your latest escapade, you find a tome full of information about the Yugoloths. Inside, it talks about how they are an evil and insideous race, bent on total destruction of everything. You bring the book into your friend's shop, and show it to him.

He laughs, and says "Oh, that. That's just propaganda, friend."

Of course, this entire time, people have been telling you how evil Yugoloths are. But no Yugoloth has ever done anything bad to you, and this Arcanaloth has told you a great many things that have all turned out to be true.

Next time you enter his shop, he informs you that he thinks someone else in your group is stealing from the whole, but he's not sure who. So now, you don't trust your comrades completely. Instead of watching their backs, you spend most of your time trying to figure out who's stealing from you.

Besides, your favorite magical dagger did go missing a few weeks back.

After a while, your group kicks you out for being too paranoid. Or maybe you started stealing, thinking you were just taking back what would be stolen anyway.

So, you go back to your Arcanaloth friend, and he helps you back onto your adventuring feet.

After another time, as you approach the shop one day, you see Bob leaving. The same Bob you and your group kicked out long ago for stealing.

Bob and you have a talk, and Bob continues to swear his innocence in the stealing, and swears the Arcanaloth will back him up. So you go inside, and sure enough the Arcanaloth admits that he was mistaken, and it must have been someone else in the group who was stealing.

So, armed to the teeth by your Arcanaloth friend, you and Bob gather a few more of your new friends, and pay your old group a vist. Sure enough, one of them has your favorite dagger, proudly wearing it on his hip. He swears the Arcanaloth sold it to him, but you know better. So, with Bob urging you on, you kill them all.

What you didn't know was that Bob and the one with your favorite dagger were in the employment of the Arcanaloth this entire time. And one more person becomes evil.

Stories almost exactly like this happen every day in the Planes.

What's Asmodeus waiting for? Why doesn't he just *boom* the multiverse already?

The fall injured him greatly, and the only thing that can heal him is the soul of a person who died an unbeliever.. not just an athiest, but one who believes that the Gods are corrupt, and none of them are truely "Godly"

That's a little hard to find.

So, he's still regaining his strength. As soon as he's back to full, he'll do it. But he's not there yet. Though once he is there, though all of Hell would oppose him if they knew, I don't think Asmodeus could be stopped. Even by the Gods themselves.

I know this isn't exactly your area of expertise - but if I was an evil character - would I be able to purge the celestial planes? Or are there just too many?

Pretty much the same rule applies above as it does below. There's just too many of them. One person couldn't even dent the numbers, much less purge them all.

I'm still interested in how Yugoloths act towards each other.

Well.. they all answer to the General of Gehenna. But, while outside of his influence, they do as they please. If they believe that a superior is wrong, they will openly and loudly point it out. Also, they are even worse backstabbers than the Devils. An Ultraloth's worst enemies are not celestials or mortals, or devils or demons.. it's his fellow Ultraloths and the Arcanaloths and Nycaloths under him.

There is an order to it, but it's a very loose order.

Solar to you and your Arcanaloth friend "Don't trust him! He's pure evil! He's a Fiend!"

Acanaloth, butting in "Why, I never! I'm not evil at all. I'm a merchant. Are you calling all merchants evil?

Solar "What? No! Of course not, but you're a Fiend!"

Arcanaloth "Oh, I see.. you're just prejudice. Sure, the Devils and Demons might be evil, but that's no reason to lump us all together just because we're in the same neighborhood. You're just prejudiced. What, are you going to tell me elves are inferior next? That all Slaadi are evil?"

Solar "Do not try to trick me, evil one!"

Arcanaloth, butting in again "See! (Yelling) He did it again! Prejudice! This Solar is Prejudice! One of the worst evils is descrimination and prejudice, friend. You don't even know me, and you're calling me evil. (Yelling again) Come One, Come All! See the Prejudiced Solar! Evil in the Heart of the Holy, right here folks!"
Solar "Ahh.. forget it."